00;00;00;10 - 00;00;30;07
Speaker 3
Hello and welcome to today's episode of Building Brand Gravity. I'm Steve Hulsey, your host. With me today is Professor Matt. I guess I should say full professor Matt Regas at DePaul University. He's with the College of Communication, where he teaches both graduate and undergraduate programs. Courses on business literacy, corporate social responsibility, entrepreneurship, media relations, digital, traditional public relations, you name it.
00;00;30;07 - 00;00;45;11
Speaker 3
If it's related to comms and advertising. The good professor has been part of that. More than 30 colleges and universities around the world are using books that he's coauthored. So, Professor Regas, it's a pleasure to have you with us here today.
00;00;45;13 - 00;00;54;16
Speaker 4
Hey, Steve. It's, it's great to see you. It's great to be here. Hopefully, I don't say something that then makes that number go down. We want to. We want to grow that number. Well, we'll.
00;00;54;16 - 00;01;17;08
Speaker 3
Make one of our KPIs. Do we add more or more colleges and universities to this? And I think really the best way to do that is just really kind of share your, your, your perspective. I mean, you've had a really interesting, academic career. You've been published tremendously, not just, the books that you coauthored, but in professional publications.
00;01;17;11 - 00;01;40;20
Speaker 3
You know, you've really demonstrated a very, just a passion for communications. I also know you're a member of, of the Page Society of Leading Communicators. So maybe we start a little bit there. What what fuels your passion about, the communications industry and, you know, makes you want to share that with, with students and professionals?
00;01;40;22 - 00;02;04;26
Speaker 4
Well, I, I, I think the start off, I would say being a professor in many ways is a calling. And so I think, you know, that, prior to going back to school and doing my doctorate and, and, becoming a little assistant professor to start things off, I did have a career in, financial communications and, business publishing and, you know what's really rewarding?
00;02;04;26 - 00;02;28;08
Speaker 4
And I know you know this because you also do a fair amount of mentoring and working with your own team and then giving back, externally, I really think when you're when you're a teacher and a mentor, you have the opportunity to give back and positively shape. You know, it's a privilege. I get to work with a lot of the future leaders of our, business.
00;02;28;10 - 00;02;54;03
Speaker 4
We've been fortunate have, have, a rising up the ranks that have come out of, you know, Chicago's a major agency in corporate, and nonprofit and cultural, hub. And so to get to use Chicago as my classroom and laboratory and launching point for my teaching and research, this past now, 13 years has really been, a gift.
00;02;54;05 - 00;03;14;20
Speaker 3
You know, we we were talking a little bit earlier just about your research. And I know that you're regularly talking to the top communicators around the world. Agency, corporate, other professors using that to inform your coursework and your books. What are you. What are you hearing? What's on the mind of the top communicators right now?
00;03;14;22 - 00;03;39;19
Speaker 4
Well, it's interesting, when we're recording this right now, I'm actually teaching a graduate seminar on the future of what we call professional communication, or procom, which is a graduate program I lead. And one of those, quarter long assignments is called Crystal Ball Conversations. And yes, you can get crystal balls on on Etsy. Big fan of Etsy.
00;03;39;21 - 00;04;14;25
Speaker 4
And so I've been interviewing different, senior leaders, folks that we both know. And it's interesting to have this conversation today because I've just concluded, in the past couple weeks, interviews with eight senior leaders, and there's definitely some overlapping themes. And I would say the really big theme, Steve, right now is we have been arguing for decades, as you know, that we need to have a seat at the table to do our jobs, you know, and be the most effective and be strategic counselors and advisors and not simply tacticians, technicians.
00;04;14;28 - 00;04;45;01
Speaker 4
We need a seat. And the senior folks consistently that I talked to said, that's great. We're getting that seat at the table. But now what do we do with it? Right? Are we going to take advantage of this opportunity or are we going to squander it, or are we going to add value? Actually, as counselors advisors, do we understand enough about the business and our clients and society to really be able to serve and stay, in that counselor and advisor, capacity?
00;04;45;01 - 00;05;09;15
Speaker 4
And I know we're going to talk about this. Our business is shifting from we've always got to be good at words and messages, crafting and sending effective messages. But hopefully we're reaching a stage in the evolution of our business where we're going to actually be counseling the actions and behaviors and the policies that we then communicate to our stakeholders through messaging.
00;05;09;22 - 00;05;27;19
Speaker 3
Well, you know, what I think is kind of interesting about that point is, you know, again, thinking about when, when I began my career and, you know, the age of the dinosaurs, where you would write a press release, you put it in an envelope, you would call the journalist, say, hey, I'm going to send you something, be on the look for it.
00;05;27;22 - 00;05;49;26
Speaker 3
You mailed it 3 to 5 days later, you called up and said, hey, did you get that? That information I sent you, you would have a discussion. And it was it was a very, kind of paced dialog. But we are in such a hyper connected, hyper, always on to the second world, you know, communications and messaging as they used to be, are no longer.
00;05;49;26 - 00;06;19;10
Speaker 3
Because when you think about corporate reputation or you think about corporate brand that's defined by every single interaction. So while things in the past may have been siloed in departments or businesses or HR or different type of communications, now all of that is falling under the purview of of the CC0. So as you're talking to them, I mean, are they feeling confident or are they feeling overwhelmed?
00;06;19;12 - 00;06;29;26
Speaker 3
Are they what are they what are what are they feeling? So they want to seize the opportunity. They've got to recognize the opportunity. And they got to be motivated to take it.
00;06;29;28 - 00;06;58;07
Speaker 4
Well, you know what I'll take? I'll take a step back. And before I answer the feelings part and observation, I think you've noticed this too, that the titles of those CC0 and top jobs are shifting to meet. I think the reality of the always on and complex world we're in. So you're seeing corporate affairs pop up in more titles, which seems to imply then that government relations, government affairs and policy, falls under it.
00;06;58;10 - 00;07;28;12
Speaker 4
You're seeing, more integrated functions of a chief communications and marketing officer. You're seeing and this aligns with page, society thought leadership. You're seeing brands sometimes explicitly in the titles, of, these senior folks, because of their responsibilities. It is more holistic, right. And just operating in silos is not going to, cut it to how they feel.
00;07;28;15 - 00;07;58;16
Speaker 4
I think there's a fair degree of, optimism when you ask about the future of our, business. And I think if we think back and we're not talking as much these days about reputation, right. Talking a lot about brand and purpose and values and ESG, if we went back 10 or 20 years ago, we were still trying to make the business case for why our function deserved that seat and role at the table and the value that we could add.
00;07;58;18 - 00;08;37;12
Speaker 4
And I think the rise of ESG stakeholder capitalism, purpose, this has permeated boardrooms and C-suite. And so I actually think it's giving us more of an opening to shine, in the link it up, we joked about the beginning KPIs. There's KPIs we can link up, and there's more measurable ways now to show tangible impact. So, I told my students a lot of times, hey, like, your forbearers, the Steves of the world, the guys that were sending mailing and maybe you were using fax machines to track a lot of acts.
00;08;37;13 - 00;08;39;17
Speaker 3
Last professor.
00;08;39;19 - 00;08;58;25
Speaker 4
Hey, hey, that was a, in the air world. That was a high end service station. That was. That was billable. There's been a lot of heavy lifting that's been done to to get these rising leaders to, I think, a clear path in many ways than, than we've had, in many years.
00;08;58;27 - 00;09;17;18
Speaker 3
Well, and I and I think as you talk through that, you know, there was a big shift again, thinking about discussions about the role and the function of senior communicators. You know, several years ago, the conversation was very much about where we should have a seat at the table because we're the corporate conscience. We're we're talking to these audiences.
00;09;17;18 - 00;09;50;25
Speaker 3
We're studying what they're talking about on social media. And really, I think when you look at the convergence of things, like you said about ESG, the rapid pace of technology, you know, you're really having what once was a role of corporate conscious, which is really more of a core corporate strategy. And you think about, you know, the strategic advisors to the CEO, you know, comms is part of everything that that happens within a corporation in a way that it never has before.
00;09;50;28 - 00;10;14;12
Speaker 3
So I guess one of the things I'd be interested in from a couple perspective, one, from what you're hearing from the professionals you're talking about. And then secondly, as you're thinking about how do you educate and train the next generation? To me it seems like there's two kind of categories that skill sets or competencies that, let's see CEOs need to have if they're going to be successful in that seat at the table.
00;10;14;14 - 00;10;55;16
Speaker 3
What is kind of what I'm calling executive skill sets, critical thinking, business acumen, outcome based focus, ability to influence, you know, that the C-suite ability to negotiate, ability to break out a 360 degree world, those are really executive level competency for anybody in the C-suite. But then there's kind of required skill sets, either among themselves or in their team, to think about deeper audience understanding and channel management reality to create compelling content, whether it's B2B, B2C or some hybrid version, and the ability to tap analytics and then now co-create.
00;10;55;23 - 00;11;14;15
Speaker 3
So that's an awful lot to kind of put in there in the two category of executive skill set and com skill set. So how do you build up a competency in that. And then from your role as as a professor, how do you teach about those different skill sets?
00;11;14;17 - 00;11;54;06
Speaker 4
Yeah, it's a it's I really like kind of thinking of it in terms of executive skill sets versus com skill sets almost. You can think of the latter is almost the meat and potatoes or the bread and butter, sort of the, the table stakes that you've, that you've got to have. And so at an undergraduate level and even at a graduate level, the comp skill sets, we shouldn't dismiss, in terms of training and development, because one thing I would say that senior folks in the business, like you see will that are that are the hiring managers and the ultimate bosses will complain about is is the level of writing and editing skills
00;11;54;06 - 00;12;24;05
Speaker 4
or the the the lack of strong writing and editing, skills and see, I think that's also tied then to good writers are generally good critical thinkers and then extend it further even to problem solving or not. And so that is something that is fundamental, I think, as, as educators or as if you're a trainer, you know, learning, learning and, development person that's really core.
00;12;24;05 - 00;12;48;21
Speaker 4
And so I think that still needs to be, part of every class, not just a, writing class. And, and of course, we also have having just developed a new graduate program, Professional Communication. We had those fascinating discussions. We did the focus groups with hiring managers and senior folks and mid-level folks and our business. How do you, level up?
00;12;48;21 - 00;13;22;10
Speaker 4
And so we have a digital media skills, class because we're all content creators now, on, on on some level. Right. But we also have a chief communication officer, business advisor, and counselor. Course. Right. That is, part of our, curriculum. The other thing that I would say Covid has really put, center stage and maybe we can talk about this is the rise of employee engagement and internal communication.
00;13;22;12 - 00;13;47;28
Speaker 4
As you know, for many years, it was kind of that stepchild. Right. And the external comms and the media relations was really the bread and butter. And maybe I see that even more because I work with young people every day. But we built multiple classes into our, our curriculum focused on effective teams and effective internal, communications and employee engagement.
00;13;48;00 - 00;14;15;03
Speaker 4
Because to live out these, these priorities, whether, you know, ESG or, purpose, employees are core to, carrying out these missions or getting getting employee activism. Right. I don't think is going away. Even if the even if the economy is cooling, that's a reality that can that can impede, the progress of our clients and organizations.
00;14;15;03 - 00;14;40;22
Speaker 3
Yeah. And, you know, employee engagement used to be pretty much the, you know, playground of, human resources. You know, it was very much about, you know, what are these engagement scores? How are we progressing? And as you've talked about, you know, the impact of Covid and and particularly, you know, among the, creative class or the class, it doesn't need to physically be in our location.
00;14;40;24 - 00;15;01;14
Speaker 3
It's really changed that dynamic. And then you look at, you know, the war for talent, you look at the great resignation. And you see study after study shows that purpose and the ability to live that purpose. People have more options than ever. So if they don't believe in the purpose of the corporation, you know they can leave. And guess what?
00;15;01;14 - 00;15;23;29
Speaker 3
Their commute is still down the hall in many cases, right? But but I did hear something the other day. I was talking to a, chief communications officer at a at a pretty large multinational, and he kind of used this, this framework, which kind of ties into what what you what you said he said, you know, there's one part which is how we work.
00;15;24;04 - 00;15;47;06
Speaker 3
How do we show the value? What about external comms and how is it change? How about internal columns? How about integrated comms? Because anything you do internally is going to be externally. And really just talking about how the teams are getting bigger and more complex, and it's less about marketing versus com and who owns the data now it's very much about how we work.
00;15;47;08 - 00;16;10;22
Speaker 3
And then there's the what we work on, you know, and really the perspective that we're working on very big core critical strategic business issues. It's no longer being the order taker. What do we say. It's those two parts. How do we work. And then what are we working on and how do we do that as a core advisor to, you know, to the CEO and the other members of the executive team?
00;16;10;25 - 00;16;32;17
Speaker 3
And I guess that for me, is is interesting, even just thinking about your role with undergraduate in the graduate program, you know, how do you start building and then reinforcing that, that mindset that you always have to grow, you always have to develop and you always know? I think it'd be static. As a comms professional.
00;16;32;19 - 00;16;54;21
Speaker 4
It is, you know, you know, it's interesting. And I think you've probably seen this with maybe some of the young people at, G and S is, you know, most curriculums will have a campaigns class, right? Whether it's a Stratcom campaigns or a PR campaigns and, and, and occasionally you hear from a young person.
00;16;54;24 - 00;17;21;21
Speaker 4
Well, I already took the campaigns class. Why am I doing something that seems like a campaign professor in your public relations and advertising entrepreneurs class? And the answer to that is, well, we're in the business of problem solving and trying to come up with solutions. And, and I think the way to help develop future leaders is through hands on, practical and experiential, learning.
00;17;21;23 - 00;17;48;08
Speaker 4
And so it's it's something that not just at DePaul, but I think public relations faculty, we've gotten the message from hiring managers and senior leaders like yourself, Steve. And so we try to do a lot of projects that have real world clients and, who have problems that we can use communication to help solve. And they don't always have a clear answer or a clear path.
00;17;48;11 - 00;18;13;07
Speaker 4
Because we are in this, this age of, as you know, agility. And there's not always straight lines and there's not paint by paint by number answers to things. And so I think it's trying to help our younger talent become comfortable with being uncomfortable. Because that's just the, you talked about this, the velocity and pace of change.
00;18;13;09 - 00;18;41;04
Speaker 4
And, who would if think, think about the events of the last 36 months and anyone that says they could have predicted, you know, that sequence of events, this kid is kidding themselves. And so part of our job, where as we develop talent again, I really think is getting them comfortable, with the uncomfortable. And because generationally, I think sometimes, younger people might feel more comfortable with it.
00;18;41;04 - 00;18;49;27
Speaker 4
And probably older folks too, with having a really clear step, you know, a sequential flowing step of of how to how to march ahead.
00;18;49;27 - 00;19;16;25
Speaker 3
Well, and, you know, I think, I think where the challenge and the opportunity lies, you know, and, and what I would say to any of your students, whether they're just taking their first class or whether it's your, you know, seasoned people in your master's is embrace the ability to shape the future. You know, whether you want to call that transformation passion or or growth or growth and transformation.
00;19;16;27 - 00;19;43;28
Speaker 3
I think really for me, the mindset that I really look for, in, in the professionals and the mindset I try and give to my clients is think about your opportunity to shape the way a business operates and what it shows to the world, and how it shows up to the world, I think. I think that is really critical because if you think about it from that lens, it's yes, you need skill sets, yes, you need campaigns, yes, you need tactics.
00;19;44;01 - 00;19;55;04
Speaker 3
But ultimately your purpose as a communicator is. And how do you shape the way your company and your organization shows up in the world?
00;19;55;06 - 00;20;26;02
Speaker 4
I think that, I think that gets right back to the the title of this podcast and the idea of the actions and activities of an organization, either attracting stakeholders to it or repelling stakeholders and different ways. And I come back again that, perhaps there's no more powerful form of communication than actual communication grounded in actions and the alignments of, words and deeds.
00;20;26;04 - 00;20;57;09
Speaker 4
I read such an interesting point, right? I mean, think about right before Covid happened, what, a year or two before, you had all the CEOs of the Business Roundtable, right. Really kind of elevate in words, at least stakeholder capitalism. And this is how we're going to run our business. And so when we're looking towards the future now, I think young people look at it with, with apt, it's an interesting mix of optimism as well as in skepticism as a, as a generation.
00;20;57;12 - 00;21;05;24
Speaker 4
They're optimistic about the future, but they're skeptical then about will the people in power actually kind of practice, what they preach?
00;21;05;25 - 00;21;31;17
Speaker 3
Well, maybe, maybe, maybe our rallying cry is a bit of a difference. You know, John F Kennedy, you know, ask not what you do for your country. Maybe it should be ask how you can shape your business's future. You know, that that could that could be maybe our challenge for the next generation of comms. So as as I get ready for the podcast, I will say I was interested, professor.
00;21;31;17 - 00;22;00;07
Speaker 3
I went to rate my professor to see how Professor Reagan stacks up. Oh geez. And I gotta say, my friend, you have an average rating of awesome, awesome. Not not great, not awesome. And I could tell why, based on our conversation here, this is just the top quote, so I won't even say is random. It was just, you know, one that was here, but it said it said, Matt is by far one of my favorite professors.
00;22;00;13 - 00;22;23;14
Speaker 3
He arrives to class early. I like that, he gets to know his student and doesn't forget about you either. He's your pleasure to have as a professor and made the material interesting and accessible. He makes you work for the grade. As long as you do your best, you'll be rewarded. And he gives the best feedback. So anyway, I just wanted to say that I was really pleased.
00;22;23;14 - 00;22;31;29
Speaker 3
My friend. When I look through rate my Professor of Awesome, hopefully this podcast elevates out a little bit.
00;22;32;01 - 00;22;41;08
Speaker 4
I remember we have to grow the number of Ron Culp, and I want to grow the number of book adopters. I want you as my publicist for everything in the future.
00;22;41;10 - 00;23;05;17
Speaker 3
Well, we can definitely work on that. Well, I know we're going to have, I have future conversations. You know, we're planning to have additional, podcasts as we go through. What are the thing that, that, Professor Regus and I also talked about is, you know, we may pull some of these outstanding students to share perspectives of, different generations of communicators.
00;23;05;20 - 00;23;18;05
Speaker 3
So, really excited and, mad to have you on, on the podcast today. Is, is there any area we didn't cover that you think we, we need to hit before we wrap today?
00;23;18;07 - 00;23;41;10
Speaker 4
No, I, I would just say, Steve, that, the when you're surrounded by young people each day and have the pleasure to help develop these future leaders, there's a lot of reasons to be optimistic, about our business. And, you know, I really like the theme you said of Create the Future. You know, that you want to create for these organizations.
00;23;41;10 - 00;24;07;13
Speaker 4
Because I will say, as rising leaders, the employee does have more influence than at any time that I can remember to be able to have a voice internally and externally, in helping brands live up to their stated purpose and values. And my last thing is just, thanks, Steve, for always being someone that, that does invest and give back, to our, our profession.
00;24;07;13 - 00;24;13;05
Speaker 4
It's, it's appreciated. And it's it's, what makes us, a great calling.
00;24;13;07 - 00;24;27;12
Speaker 3
Well, I appreciate it. And as always, I appreciate the perspective. And, I'm sure the listeners are building brand gravity are going to be, excited to hear future conversations from us. Professor, thank you so much for your time today.
00;24;27;14 - 00;24;31;25
Speaker 4
Thank you.
00;24;31;27 - 00;25;00;28
Speaker 2
We are GM's business communications. We are a team of media strategists, storytellers and engagement experts who meet you at the intersection of business and communications. To learn more, visit communications.com. You're listening to Building Brand Gravity, Attracting People into Your Orbit, a business communications podcast. Keep connected with us by subscribing to the show in your favorite podcast player.
00;25;01;04 - 00;25;12;18
Speaker 2
If you like what you've heard, please rate the show that helps us to keep delivering the latest in industry influence. Thanks for listening. Until next time.
